Linux Laptops: The Ultimate Birthday Present?
My brother-in-law wants to buy his daughter a cost-effective laptop for her 13th birthday. As I made my recommendations, I realized the terrible bind consumers currently face. He’s frustrated with Windows, too price sensitive to buy a MacBook and vaguely familiar with Linux. Here’s where the conversation went, and how you can help his decision process.
When my brother in law reached out to me, he had the following perceptions:
- Windows Laptops: He doesn’t want a low-cost Windows Vista laptop because they aren’t powerful enough to really run Vista, plus he isn’t impressed with Vista. He’s willing to pay for Windows XP preinstalled, but worries about Microsoft ending support for the operating system
- Apple MacBooks: He loves Apple but doesn’t want to pay $1,000 or more for an entry-level laptop.
- Linux: He’s heard of Linux but he assumed it was only for business systems and not available for consumer machines.
So, what’s a consumer to do? Stick with Microsoft — even if you don’t want Windows? Stretch your budget and buy a Mac? Or is Linux really ready for consumers?
Fact is, most consumers don’t know about Linux or OpenOffice. But that’s changing. The conversation shifted gears when I showed my brother-in-law my Dell desktop with Ubuntu Linux pre-installed, and I also showed him my son’s Asus Eee PC — the sub-notebook with a seven-inch screen.
Lingering Doubts
He was impressed but also had some concerns. Could a Linux system connect to his home printers? Would his daughter quickly get up to speed on Linux? What about Microsoft Office support?
I showed him how easy OpenOffice and Ubuntu are to use, and also started printing away on my home systems. Then I described how OpenOffice comes with most Linux systems — at no extra cost — or is freely downloadable from the Internet.
He was floored.
Many consumers are happy with Microsoft Office — really, they are — but it’s clear that some consumers want an alternative. If only more of them knew about OpenOffice.
Enter Lenovo
I nearly had my brother-in-law convinced that a laptop with Linux and OpenOffice is the way to go. But entry-level systems (from Dell, System76 and ZaReason) didn’t offer much (if any) savings compared to a Windows laptop.
I told him to stop thinking about head-to-head price issues. I assured him that Linux will run better and faster, and requires less memory and processing horsepower.
Sticking With Windows?
Then he stumbled upon a great deal for a Lenovo ThinkPad, pre-loaded with Windows Vista and 4GB of RAM for about $750 or $800. I don’t have all of the machine specs handy, but it certainly sounded like a good deal — and it was a one-time offer from a friend in the business.
So, it sounds like he’s going with the ThinkPad with Vista. But I mad one final pitch for Linux and OpenOffice: If he purchases a Vista-based laptop and his daughter doesn’t like it, my brother-in-law agreed to give Linux a try on the system. Also, I think he’s willing to put OpenOffice on the ThinkPad, and bypass Microsoft Office entirely.
Note: If you want to steer my brother-in-law to a Linux system, there’s still time to act. But don’t bother bashing Windows. Make your case by describing a specific entry-level Linux laptop with WiFi and OpenOffice.
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This sounds like a situation I was in a few months ago. I bought a Gateway laptop from Tiger direct with an AMD dual core processor and 1GB of memory. It had Vista and I immediately ordered another GB of memory for it. Funny thing is when I put Ubuntu on that same laptop (dual boot) Ubuntu at 1GB runs circles around Vista at 2GB. So I definitely agree on the hardware situation. With less hardware you can do more with Linux.
In the last two weeks I have taken my Linux/Vista laptop out to help get printers set up. Once for an old color laser printer, very simply just did not want to work for Vista and worked immediately under Ubuntu, this also was the case for a “Vista Ready” printer. Strange how an O/S that hardware wasn’t even designed for works better than the O/S that hardware was supposed to work on.
Microsoft Office was really the last hurdle for me to us Linux at home. I love open office and what they are doing but there are just times that MS Office is what I need. I currently have Office 2003 working pretty well under Wine, but this may not be the best for a first time user, but is available if it is a hang up.
Thanks for the thoughts. Generally speaking I don’t think Wine is the answer for consumers because it’s yet another niche tool that requires some more advanced expertise.
[...] how little mainstream consumers know about Linux and OpenOffice — and Ubuntu consumer systems. Here’s his story so [...]
quote: Funny thing is when I put Ubuntu on that same laptop (dual boot) Ubuntu at 1GB runs circles around Vista at 2GB. So I definitely agree on the hardware situation. With less hardware you can do more with Linux.
What applies to Ubuntu also applies to any other Linux, Like Mandriva, for example, some of the other Linuxes are also easier administer, install and configure, than Ubuntu.
does he want his daughter to have a certain technical advantage over her classmates? Linux is the go. Its a learning curve, but when you’re 13, its not so steep.
A new laptop is great. You have all the media available to you if you make a mistake, and you can completely ignore the ‘backup before you do anything’ caveats that always get attached to beginners linux.
Anyway, back to the ‘advantage’ I mentioned above – let her play with the machine, let her break it, let her fix it. The beautiful thing about Linux is the wealth of information on doing just that.
Niko: She’s more interested in IMing with friends, email, Web 2.0 sites, etc. I don’t think she’ll ever look under Linux’s hood.
Tracyanne: I pointed out to my brother-in-law that 1GB of memory would be great for Linux, pathetic for Vista. I think he’s still looking for a simple recommendation describing which Linux laptop to buy, if any.
Otherwise, I sense he’s going with the Lenovo ThinkPad running Windows Vista.
You could offer to do a dual boot set up for him. My recommendation would be Mandriva, it’s what I install for Windows refugees, but I’m sure you are more familiar with Ubuntu.
Have your brother-in-law checkout linuxcertified, their computers might be in his price range. I have bought my last two laptops from them and their support is great.
I recently bought a HP Compaq 6720s laptop for some development and testing at work. Unfortunately it came preloaded with Vista. Which quite frankly, runs like a dog and doesn’t install some of the apps we use round here.
I installed Ubuntu on it (and then Fedora, gOS, Debian, centOS – did I mention it was a testing machine?) – Everything works, 3d accel, printers, LAN, wireless (this particular laptop doesn’t have bluetooth). Without me having to look for drivers on any of these Linux versions.
Eventually I had to try winXP on it and it was having none of it! I can’t for the life of me make XP work at all. But all these Linix versions just worked. I suppose Vista will be OK if I try put that back on but my point is this.
Linux is clearly easier to install, faster and better supported on entry level laptop hardware than any MS OS.
tracyanne: I agree with you on that about what works with Ubuntu works with other distros. I have ran Mandriva on the same setup, but this being workswithu I kept my example to Ubuntu.
I don’t know if this is seen as a selling point or not, but with Linux there’s really nothing more to install or download for general use as long as someone is happy using the opensource alternatives.
A few more observations… Tracyanne @7: You are correct in that I’ve offered to set up a dual-boot approach once he selects a system.
Richard @8: I am sending him over to linuxcertified again. We spent a few minutes there last weekend but it’s good to hear somebody else recommend that site.
Wstout @10: It is definitely a selling point that everything (OpenOffice, etc.) comes with Linux. My brother in law couldn’t believe all the apps bundled with Ubuntu … and the easy download menu system to help select more free apps.
She’s more interested in IMing with friends, email, Web 2.0 sites, etc. I don’t think she’ll ever look under Linux’s hood.
Nor does she need to. Instant Messaging, web surfing and e-mail all take comfortably place in the GUI.
The big plus is Linux’s resilience against malware. The chance of getting infected with stuff on Linux is a lot smaller than on Win32 systems. It’s not that Linux is immune, but its saner defaults, actively enforced user separation and the fact that Linux consumer systems are targeted less, make for a safer experience.
Another thing is system maintenance. Windows always needs a babysitter. Linux on the other hand just needs to be setup properly to have a system that needs minimal administering. If it works, it works. If it doesn’t, it’s not ready yet. Try again in six months (rapid development!). No defragging. No registry “cleaning”. Sane software management (add/remove really adds and removes). No heavy AV/Firewall suites bogging the system down, a lightweight AV solution to keep your Windows using peers safe and a lightweight Firewall are more than enough.
Now the only roadblock is your brother-in-law. Can he leave his comfort zone and venture out into uncharted territory? Don’t be disappointed if the laptop will be running Vista. Although Linux has been ready for “The Desktop” for years, it is only starting to get ready for the mainstream. The trick here is to refrain from pushing people towards Linux too early. Never was a naysayer more vehement in denying the feasibility of Linux on the desktop as the one confronted with Linux at a time s/he wasn’t ready for it…
Just a few months ago i bought a lenovo 3000 n200 without any
OS for 380€.Installation of Debian (Lenny) was not so difficult, but some configuration took a while. Later i also installed PCLinuxOS and mostly everything worked out of the box. The Notebook has only 512MB, but i’m still very satified with the performance.
When i was around 13 my first computer was a Atari ST with monochrome Monitor. There haven’t been so many games for it, so i had to program them myself. In this time I learned so much things is still have advantage from and that after many years without computers. It’s maybe similar to the situation on linux today. If your brother in law wants his daughter not only to play with the computer but to learn something he should get a notebook without windows.
Alexander: Atari ST, eh? I grew up programming BASIC on the Atari 800. Sweet.
quote: I don’t know if this is seen as a selling point or not, but with Linux there’s really nothing more to install or download for general use as long as someone is happy using the opensource alternatives.
This is definitely a selling point. It’s one of the ways I sell Linux. The fact that everything they need is already there is quite impressive as far as the people I’ve dealt with so far, are concerned.
I usually install Mandriva, then install all the usuall suspects for desktop use, Open Office, Inkscape, Various media players, Codecs, Scribus, little things like gLabels (for making CD and covers, skype, Kopete etc, With few exceptions, ie people who are into windows games (not the biggies) the little one like scrabble (a nice GUI based scrabble for Linux would be good) and other word games, usually install fine under WINE, so I set those up for anyone who asks about that sort of thing.
The only other non standard install was Quickbooks for our Postie (she has a Post Office agency – private business – and does her accounts with quickbooks).
BTW: the people I do this for wouldn’t attempt to install any OS, no matter how easy. They are the sort of people who are in general intimidated by technology.
Lenovo/IBM is a good choice. My kids always got used/refurb computers, and a refurb/used Thinkpad T40 running Ubuntu is what my grad school daughter is running right now. The T40 is a tough machine, metal chassis, unlike the Dells. I highly recommend it, especially for a 13 y.o. who will likely subject it to a few bumps, no matter how careful she is with it.
The T40 is an excellent Linux platform, comes with integrated wifi and can be had as a refurb from several places on the net for around $500. I got mine from USANotebook.com
Dont push linux on anyone…yet.
Some people are ready for it, and linux is a great alternative, but sometimes, us linux users forget that there are still a few warts to iron out. If you give them linux, and they hate it, then they will be unwilling to try it again in the future. In the open source world, even a year is an eternity in features and usability, they may just have to be converted slowly, or at a later date…..dont worry, I think the eepc is going to be the device to convert/familiarize enough people.
Update: He purchased the Lenovo with Windows Vista. Sounds like the deal occurred in a dark ally. Deeply discounted Lenovo ThinkPad for $675. I don’t have the specs handy, but it sounded like an amazing deal — despite the bundled operating system
Make sure to update this forum when he calls for help with the first spyware problem/system crash.
I am guessing 90 days max.
As for you recommending Linux, it sounds like you made a good effort. My 75 year old grandmother’s computer recently crapped out. She was running Windows 95 on a 600 Mhz box! She didn’t have the financial resource to replace it, so I bought her one of the $299 Mirus machines from Sears.com (removed Freespire and installed Ubuntu). She doesnt even know that it doesn’t run Windows and she couldn’t be happier.
-Jason
I bet your brother-in-law has lots of experience with Windows. With such a background, how can he be anything but sceptical with Linux? After all he thinks the machine must be rebooted at least once a day and updates come out every six months (if that).
I’m afraid you won’t convince him to go with Linux until he uses it for a while himself. When he sees the difference firsthand, he’ll change his mind.
In case your brother in law is not satisfied with Windows then Linux may not work unless it is Linux compatible. I am not sure if the Lenovo thinkpad is Linux compatible. However rest of the open source programme OpenOffice, Firefox, GIMP, Audacity, VLC Media/ Mplayer should work fine.
[QUOTE]I am not sure if the Lenovo thinkpad is Linux compatible[/QUOTE]
These days, all you need to do to ensure a laptop is GNU/Linux compatible is check that it’s an Intel chipset with on-board Intel graphics.
He won’t go wrong with a Thinkpad (even if he does with Vista!), they’re built like tanks!
There’s a whole website dedicated to running Linux on Thinkpads:
http://www.thinkwiki.org/wiki/ThinkWiki
(should you ever need to “upgrade” the OS) Just kidding, Thinkpads have an amazing “blue button” that will allow you to restore the installed OS from an image on HDD. The only problems I can forsee, are the crudding up of the system with spyware and viruses (and the sluggishness, due to the anti-virus programs — our IT department recommends AVG, by the way)
Hope she likes it, and remember that website!
I just took delivery of a refurb Dell Latitude D410, has a 12.1″ screen, 1.6 Ghz Pentium M, 512 MB Ram, 40 GB hard drive, Intel chipset wireless and Windows XP Pro. Price was $365 from Dell Financial Services, condition was near perfect, battery life is around 3 hrs in performance mode and so far with just anti-virus and Firefox added to the base XP install it flat out flys. Would be perfect for a 13 yr old girl. Think the weight is just under 4 lbs. From what I understand this one is very Linux friendly and I’ll either dual boot Mint or PCLinuxOS in a week or so after I am certainly the machine doesn’t have any issues. As of last night they had a few of the D410s for <$300 without OS and that would have been my choice has it been available when I bought my XP one. Highly recommended! Can read about it more at my blog, http://montysreality.blogspot.com
Monty
If it’s for a 13 year old girl the answer is fairly simple (unfortunately) and that’s the answer to the question:
“Does it run The Sims?”
I find Windows laughable compared to Linux in most cases but I was in that exact situation a few months ago and that was the one request (or rather demand) she had.
So no matter how stupid I felt buying a Dell/Vista machine did I really have a choice?
I say show him the new MSI Wind coming up, and or the new Acer Mini One. 1/2 the price of the Vista notebook, excellent wifi, OO, skype, they are configured for multimedia, etc. The one thing you didn’t mention. Why type of MP3 player does she have. iPod (and DRMed iTunes content), Zune or subscription based? If none, make sure to recommend SanDisk.
TripleII
I purchased a System76 Darter for my parents (age 69 and 73), who are not computer literate but wanted a computer for web surfing, email, simple word processing. Although the system wasn’t cheaper than a Windows based PC, the hardware components were top notch (ASUS motherboard, solid casing, etc.). I recommended a Dell linux machine (Inspiron 1420n) to a friend and I was more impressed with the System76 build quality than with the Dell unit. I live 1,500 miles from my parents and I simply deliver the machine to them over a quick visit, and it runs without failure.
Note: I am not against a Dell linux machine and would consider purchasing one in the future.
A few weeks ago, I purchased an ASUS eeePC 2G Surf and enjoying this little guy more than I expected and recommend one of the eeePC (4G, 4G Surf, 8G, or 901) depending on how much money wants to spend. With the eeePC 2G Surf I do IM, web browsing (Firefox), email, watch videos, play music, Skype’ing, word processing, spreadsheets, etc. The lightness of this machine is impressive. In a couple of years, I will be purchasing a eeePC, or something similar, when my kids get a few years older.
I am looking forward to Dell’s upcoming Dell E line ($299-$499) that may be released in two or three months.
The reason I recommend linux based systems has nothing to do with price, interface design, etc. For me, the reliability and ease of maintenance (i.e., don’t have to deal with viruses, defragging, spyware) makes my life so easy, I couldn’t think of using anything else. Once the system is setup and does what you want, just use the machine day after day without hassle in my opinion.
Hope this helps.
If he sticks with Vista, you can still have him start using open source Windows applications like OpenOffice, GIMP, Firefox, etc. That’ll make his eventual transition to Linux later easier.
@A.Y. Siu: I completely agree. I plan to push OpenOffice and FireFox and two must-haves for my niece.
also, many of the IM’s have a port: Emesene, amsn, pidgin, etc.
Use an ubuntu theme (no harm done it’s only a theme), that’s what i set up my brother with and he had no problem with it. he was also a bit tire of the default vista.
get em here:
http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=856096
A bit late, just read this thread with lots of interest.
I use Ubuntu for about 18 months on my home computer. Prime reason: I got totally fed up with anti-virus apps eating up all CPU cycles, and how much time it took to boot and shut down. For fun I installed Ubuntu on a 1GHz P-III PC with 256MB RAM, and it ran like a charm. boot up in 30 seconds, everything works, performance acceptable, and shuts down again in 10 seconds. That, and the fact that everything looks & feels like Windows was enough to get us going.
The big kicker for me: because of Ubuntu’s excellent performance you can settle for really cheap simple computers. And admin hassle on PCs is minimal; when it works, it works.
What I had to do to make it acceptable to the family:
- install Netscape Thunderbird for email, and convert all Outlook archives. Took an hour, but pretty straightforward.
- install Wine for those few apps you like and have no alternative for (my kids use it for playing games)
- install ODF import- & export modules (you can download for free from the Sun website) for those who wish to stick to Office. That way both sides can accept each other’s files.
And typically Ubuntu is a bit behind on what you are used to on Windows apps – just be patient. A solution always comes around. To the average user this is no issue.
I think it’s a good idea he getting familiar with Ubuntu-Linux – in a short time he will realise how useless ms-windows is, as fine i realised (it’s not bashing, it’s only my humble personal oppinion)
The idea of only using open-source applications on ms-windows is good as well – it helped on me as well – it helps a very faster and easier migration.
The main idea about people seems to concern about the migration is the tipical ‘why must i learn everything again’ (not properly the case, since Ubuntu 9.04 is much more easier to use than Vista or windows-7, my humble oppinion again), when the most important is to learn generally how an operating system and usual applications works in common, helping being more open to changes when they happens.